Podcast Transcript | Ep. 72

Authenticity, Overcoming Resistance, and Personal Branding Power with Aleana Kali | Ep. 72

Authenticity, Overcoming Resistance, and Personal Branding Power with Aleana Kali | Ep. 72

[00:00:00] Brandon Ward: Hello, and welcome to Order Within, navigating a world of endless chaos and crisis. Many of us are experiencing inner turmoil, insecurity, anxiety, fears, and isolation. These feelings are only being amplified by new cycles social media, and never ending political madness. How do we find our way out of the chaos?

[00:00:24] How do we find strength within ourselves? How do we find meaning in a world driven by materialism? These questions and many more I aim to answer on the show. My goal is to be a trusted guide on your journey to selfhood. May you find what you seek.

[00:00:41] Hello and welcome everyone. I'm your host Brandon Ward, back with another episode of Order Within. I'm excited we're continuing on the new conversations here. At Order Within, we've got a phenomenal guest here who's really, uh, a marketing and content creating [00:01:00] Badass Aliana Ali is joining us today. Aliana is the founder at Brands Are Alive.

[00:01:08] She helps heart-centered entrepreneurs and creators build brands full of self-expression. Traditional marketing tells you to look at what buyers want and build your brand around it, but Aliana wants you to uncover who you are at your core and build your brand around that instead to turn up the volume on your message and attract those who are meant to be transformed through your work to make more money while being yourself and doing what you love so you can learn more about her company.

[00:01:34] Brands are alive. We'll link to all that and the show notes below. Eliana welcome.

[00:01:39] Aleana Kali: Thank you. Thank you for that lovely introduction,

[00:01:42] Brandon Ward: My pleasure. Well, it's nice to have a nice little write up there for, for the, the lead way in. And, and truthfully like it's a great description of what you do and, and it's one of the reasons I was drawn to you. I recently just discovered your content on LinkedIn. Uh, you and I both publish content regularly.

[00:01:58] You've got a YouTube channel [00:02:00] as well. Um, so having you on the show is great because you're such a, a, a proponent of authenticity and, and order Within is really all about that living authentic to who we are and, and the inner worlds. And so you have a, a deep, I think, love for that.

[00:02:16] Would you agree?

[00:02:17] So

[00:02:18] Aleana Kali: absolutely.

[00:02:18] Brandon Ward: let's maybe talk there.

[00:02:19] I've got a list of things that I want to get there. We're gonna try to get through today. We're gonna aim for around an hour. I know you're a busy gal, so we gotta make sure to, to honor that time. But let's maybe break down kind of what spawned all this for you, if you will, and kind of what, what sparked the, uh, inspiration behind your brand and what you're doing now.

[00:02:36] Aleana Kali: With friends are alive, you mean?

[00:02:38] Brandon Ward: Yeah, and just your approach to, to marketing and branding, and

[00:02:41] Aleana Kali: Yeah, sure. Uh, God, there's so much I can say, and I don't wanna tell you my life story because that's gonna

[00:02:49] there's, there's some, because this, because this is, this is one of those things that I feel like I really integrated everything in my, my life. All the lessons and everything crystallized [00:03:00] into one thing.

[00:03:00] So there's a lot that seemingly had nothing to do with this, but eventually looking back, I'm like, oh, this is because of that experience or that lesson I learned. But the gist of it is I was as, as a kid, I was like all kids, I think all about self-expression because that's what the inner artist in us and the inner creator wants to do.

[00:03:23] We are all the sparks of life. This, this, um, I like to say that we are all like a, a unique expression of the universe and that this unique expression can only be, can only come alive through you in this one form and. Uh, as a kid I was obviously very aware of that, but like a lot of people, you know, life happened and kind of had to focus on survival and making money.

[00:03:46] So like a lot of people, I had this desire to express myself, but then reality hit and it, and I was in a really tough situation where I had to focus on making money and I had a lot of wounds of, of, you know, I'll [00:04:00] spare you all the details for now, but. I got to a point where I was like, okay, I really ha I have to do the next thing and the next thing and the next thing to feel complete, to feel good about myself, to feel like I'm somebody, to feel that I'm worthy to feel. I was constantly chasing this emotion of, am I enough and not even aware of it. I wasn't consciously asking the question. It manifested as this hyper achievement that was driven by this constant feeling of I'm just not enough and I need to do something to become enough. And it just constantly kept pushing and pushing and pushing and pushing, and it, it got to a point where, okay, I, on the outside, I achieved any, everything that I thought I wanted. I built the business that I thought I wanted, I made the money that I thought I wanted to make. I did everything that I wanted to do. My life on paper was perfect. So why wasn't I feeling this way? Why wasn't I feeling the way that I wanted to feel? And how do I even want to feel? I have no idea what feeling right is like, because I had been so disconnected. From my emotions for so [00:05:00] long that I was like, I just know this is not it.

[00:05:03] I like to say that it felt like being a main character in the wrong movie.

[00:05:07] You know? It's like, okay, on paper, this sounds great, but this is not for me. This is not, I know that my, if I have the soul, it didn't come to this planet to do that, you know?

[00:05:20] Brandon Ward: Hmm.

[00:05:21] Aleana Kali: So I really, uh, felt towards the end before I decided to make the switch. I felt like I could no longer push through. I was struggling to do the smallest tasks in my last business. I was, um, you know, something that would take somebody else five or 10 minutes. It would take me five hours.

[00:05:41] I just had so much resistance because all my life I was so driven by making more money and success and whatever, and I finally achieved that.

[00:05:51] I had the recognition, I had everything. So it was like, okay. I have nothing to, uh, wake up for, you know, [00:06:00] to, to not, nothing to wake up for, but nothing to motivate me to do more, more money just wasn't going to get me out of bed. More what? More of whatever I had just wasn't working anymore, you know?

[00:06:12] And I had already gone this cycle of, you know, pa pushing past a certain limit of how I viewed myself and what I was capable of sabotaging myself, going back to struggle, building myself up again, and just constantly getting myself in these situations where I would just sabotage myself to recreate it.

[00:06:33] But as I kept doing the inner work and healing, it got to a point where, okay, I've, I'm forced to face my humanity. I'm forced to face, why do I feel this way? What's missing? And what I found is that I just had this innate feeling that something within me wanted to express. Something wanted to be created. There's some something in me that needed to be said, and I didn't know what it was. [00:07:00] I just felt like I had a lot of anger and I knew what I didn't want. I knew what I didn't like about the industry I'm in. I knew what I didn't like about marketing. I know what I didn't like about the way I was working with the clients and what I didn't like about the way business was being done. And it just got to a point where I could no longer push through or do things that are out of, out of alignment. It, it sucked my soul to have to use my time, energy, and everything within me, my existence to sell a freaking product that meant nothing to me. And it's not that these people like were unethical, it's just I started to question what's the point of all of this? Okay, now what yes, I have a business and it's making money and, and I should be happier, but now what? What's the point of all of this? And I just remember, like I said, I got to a point where I could no longer push myself to do the work. I was working sometimes less than an hour a day. Three hours a day was a busy day. I work. [00:08:00] So on paper it sounds great. It's like younger me would've done anything to get there. But, you know, I had all this time for myself and I was just, um, I felt really like I was missing something and well, obviously I was missing something, but I, I just constantly kept looking for, basically, I needed a lot of stimulation in life to feel good.

[00:08:23] Every meal had to be a gourmet meal. Every I need to go out. I need to, okay, now I need to eat something. Okay, now I need to plan a trip. Okay, now I need this. There's always this emptiness that just needs to be filled with a doing, having, creating, and I'm not talking about just distraction. I'm just talking about this like hunger in my soul that just could not be filled.

[00:08:46] And the reality is actually, all that, that I needed really was to s um, tend to myself or stop neglecting myself emotionally and at the same time say yes [00:09:00] to what my heart really desired, which is to express myself as who I really am instead of suppressing some parts of myself because I thought that, that I could not bring them to work, that I had to be a different character. I couldn't do marketing my way. I had to choose something different or do, or do business in marketing the way other people expected me to be instead of being in, in alignment with who, who I was. So this was this constant push against my nature, and it was just, yeah, it was like this long process of fight, not fighting, but at first it was a fight, but then ultimately it was okay, now I have to accept all these parts of myself and find a way to love them and integrate them in the work that I do, even though there's part of me that wants to reject those things. So it meant that I had to. Not run away from marketing or business or say, you know what, this, I reject this, but instead, can I bring who I am and can I bring what I believe in to this work and pay the price, whatever price that is, whether it's [00:10:00] letting go of some clients that are paying good money, but we're not in alignment, letting go of work that on paper sounds good, but for whatever freaking reason doesn't excite me.

[00:10:11] And you know what? I'd rather do that. I'd rather say no to the things that I know I know are not in alignment with why I'm here that are not meaningful to me. And pursue the things that maybe don't make sense on paper that's like, you're gonna let go of this and go do this. Yes. Or you're gonna let go of this really profitable niche.

[00:10:29] You have no reason why, like, the only reason is because you're not excited about it anymore and you wanna go do this. Thing of full self-expression in marketing and branding and sounds stupid and crazy, and what will people say? And like, nobody will take you seriously. That was one of the big things that I had.

[00:10:44] Nobody will take me seriously. Um, and, and you're, you're gonna sound crazy or maybe you are crazy. You know, I had all these things that I just, I needed to work through in order to really allow myself to, um, to be who I am. And I found that, that what drove me was that I, I, [00:11:00] I really wanted my clients to be their full self expression.

[00:11:02] So I would constantly, even though they would hire me to like, help them with their strategic stuff and their, how do I make money, but I would find myself just out of nowhere trying to get them to follow their hearts and trying to get them to follow their passion, their purpose. And at some point you look at that, you know, you go, I'm being a hypocrite.

[00:11:22] I'm telling these people to do that, but I'm not doing that in my own business. I kind of had to make that transition. That's a long-winded way of, uh, telling the

[00:11:29] Brandon Ward: No, it's amazing.

[00:11:31] Aleana Kali: I really needed to say, basically everything that I was going through is because I didn't know at the time that I, what I needed was full self-expression.

[00:11:38] I had no idea what the heck that was. What I knew was that I worked my ass off. I kept pursuing the next achievement and the next achievement and the next achievement. I constantly worked to, to prove myself to myself first and to other people as well. If I were being honest with myself. Like I worked really hard to prove something that I was a somebody [00:12:00] and I did everything and I got to where I wanted to go, and I felt the way that I felt. And ultimately all I knew at that point is I have no energy. I can't do this.

[00:12:11] Brandon Ward: Hmm.

[00:12:11] Aleana Kali: Um, you know, it manifested first as like complete depletion. I knew I wasn't tired. I just did not want to, I had no motivation, essentially, zero, none. Um, and

[00:12:22] Brandon Ward: resistance is, is very powerful indicator,

[00:12:25] Aleana Kali: absolutely.

[00:12:26] Brandon Ward: like that's, there's a ton that resonates with what you shared as well. I, I experienced some very similar things in my career and something that I've thought about a lot is that space between who we are and the life we're living, the la the, the bigger that space is, the larger that gap, the more suffering we experience.

[00:12:45] And, and to me that's, that's you recognizing and especially that hyper achiever component. I very similar. That's the way I grew up. Like, and a lot of that is driven the way we're raised. You know, conditional love is dictated around how good we are at [00:13:00] sports or in school or the things that we do. So we attach our worth to

[00:13:04] achievement and like we internalize all these things.

[00:13:06] And you, you revealed some of that about your own inner dialogue, how you were reviewing yourself.

[00:13:12] Aleana Kali: Yeah,

[00:13:12] Brandon Ward: Like saying that people won't take me seriously, that the trying to fill the void. Right. I also know that like where it's partying, it's drinking, it's all the things you need the most rich, delicious, insane meal every day to feel good like,

[00:13:26] Aleana Kali: Right.

[00:13:26] Brandon Ward: eat a bowl oatmeal and be fine.

[00:13:28] It's okay. It doesn't, it doesn't have to be five stars. Right? it's,

[00:13:31] Aleana Kali: Yeah.

[00:13:32] Brandon Ward: but when you're feeling that lack, and when I

[00:13:35] say lack, I mean that internal disconnect, like

[00:13:38] the lack of connection to our authentic self. That's the experience you have and which, so I, I appreciate you being vulnerable and open about that because I, I think a lot of people don't realize how common that way of feeling is.

[00:13:55] And we live in a very socially connected world, [00:14:00] which can drive us towards specific behaviors that. Creates a lack of trust in ourselves. And

[00:14:06] I think that's, to me, like what you were speaking so heavily to is

[00:14:09] in your mind you have this idea of what you're supposed to be

[00:14:12] Aleana Kali: Mm-hmm.

[00:14:13] Brandon Ward: and you have all this stuff on paper, but really internally you're miserable and you're what you were wanting to do for yourself.

[00:14:18] You're trying to push your clients to do

[00:14:20] Aleana Kali: Oh,

[00:14:21] yes.

[00:14:21] Brandon Ward: their, their heart,

[00:14:22] right? Like,

[00:14:23] Aleana Kali: Yeah.

[00:14:23] Brandon Ward: but it's, it's funny to me 'cause that's an, a prime example of how our interstates can be mirrored by the world and the way we're interacting with others around us. So

[00:14:34] I appreciate you going deep into that because it's, it's, it's tough.

[00:14:38] But I think but the, the upside is though, is once you start to see it, and this is what I wrote too, is it all actually starts with the negative. You, you start to see how things just aren't working. You don't even know what needs to work.

[00:14:51] Who you are necessarily like the values you have. Right? I see. Like you get so, but it, it almost always starts with something's wrong.[00:15:00]

[00:15:00] I don't know why. But

[00:15:02] so for, for listeners out there, like if you're finding yourself in similar situations, one, that's a great indicator that adjustments change, need to be made.

[00:15:11] Two, it's a huge blessing to recognize that because

[00:15:14] it's the starting point of the potential change.

[00:15:17] And three, no matter where you find yourself, no matter how miserable you may be by the prison you created for yourself, you can change it all.

[00:15:26] It's just

[00:15:26] Aleana Kali: absolutely.

[00:15:27] Brandon Ward: and loving yourself.

[00:15:29] Aleana Kali: Absolutely. I wanna speak to that piece. I'm so glad you brought it up because I, I just remembered now and wow, like, I forgot how painful this was. There was a period where I didn't know what was wrong, let alone how to fix it. And I wanna speak to that because I think that's that lack of clarity about what exactly is the problem here, what's the cause of, this is one of the most painful experiences.

[00:15:51] It's one thing to have a problem, it's another thing to not, to have no context of the problem that you have. And I just remember this [00:16:00] feeling of fuzziness having no clarity whatsoever. Just knowing, like you said, there's something wrong, but I don't know what right is. I know what I

[00:16:08] don't

[00:16:09] Brandon Ward: like a haze or something, isn't it?

[00:16:10] Aleana Kali: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[00:16:11] Exactly. It's exactly, it's like, it's like I know what is not working, I know what is wrong, but I don't know what the alternative is.

[00:16:19] And what I wish I knew at the time is that, uh, the alternative is exactly the opposite of what you don't want to start. When, When, I'm working with people and I, I wanna help them gain that clarity. I try to not start from what is not working in your life, right. I, I try to start from, forget about everything that's around, let go of the box. Like if we're starting from scratch, if you didn't spend 20 years building this kind of career and you didn't have this, and you didn't have this, if everything If money was no issue, if nothing was an issue, like, what do you truly, truly desire? And we start from there. But if a lot of times some people, a lot of people actually, myself included, [00:17:00] I was so disconnected from my heart. I was so disconnected from my passions. I was, I, I hadn't followed any hobbies for years.

[00:17:07] I hadn't, I wasn't really listening to myself and to what I genuinely enjoyed. So when anybody asks me, what do you want? I had no idea. Because I have no idea. I'm just like, I don't know what I wanna do with my life. I don't know what I'm passionate about. I feel nothing. I just know I'm angry and sad and upset and I don't like this. And so what I would tell somebody who has no idea is start with the opposite of what is, like you said, you know, it starts with, I'm not happy with this. This is not working. Okay. What would be the opposite of this? Start with that. At least sometimes we just, we, we have to. Run away from something. I always say, you wanna run towards something as opposed to running away from something.

[00:17:49] Sometimes you have no, I, no idea what you're running towards. And you just kind of have be like, you know what? I'm just gonna run away from this. I don't want this.

[00:17:57] You know? And, uh, let's just work on that and then we can [00:18:00] figure out what do we actually want. And another thing you said that I loved was you can always make improvement from where you are.

[00:18:07] I had so many stories about why I couldn't change. I have people to take care of. I have real responsibilities. I need the money. I can't do this. Nobody will take me seriously. And all of these other inner things, that was a different story. But the outer world also, I felt like I had lots of reasons. They were real, they were valid. So, you know, when we say excuses, we're not saying they're not real. Right? Like They're real. It's happening. You do have these responsibilities, but often we think that change has to be this 180 degree, but the reality, it actually happens in the 1% changes every day. What can you do better? There's always something you can do a little bit better from wherever you are. Maybe you can't quit the job or leave your business and start another one tomorrow. Maybe you don't have money to take a six month vacation. Maybe you don't have, you know, uh, I don't know the resources to create, to build [00:19:00] that retreat center or whatever. Maybe you don't have these things yet, but you can start from wherever you are.

[00:19:06] You can take a step in that direction, even if you have no idea where you're going. Eventually, you can start from, I have no idea what I want to build, but I know I'd like to have a business where I'm having more fun and I'm more relaxed, and I'm peaceful. Okay, what can I do in my day-to-day right here, right now to make my current situation more fun, more peaceful, and more relaxing? Just start from there. And I know it sounds simplistic, but truly that's how you build it. You have to activate this thing by taking action in that direction and doing it over and over and over. Once you are in the feeling state, that's when the ideas come in.

[00:19:43] problem is we try to figure it out and hope that once we have it, we will feel a certain type of way.

[00:19:49] It's actually a lot of times the other way around, when you're in a certain mental and emotional state, in a state of being, you will have thoughts, ideas, and beliefs [00:20:00] that are matching to that feeling, but it's actually starts from the feeling. So if we disconnect from how we feel, good or bad, imagine what kind of life we have.

[00:20:08] Of course. We have no idea. Yeah.

[00:20:10] Brandon Ward: It's, it's void of those things.

[00:20:11] And I, and I, that's, there's so much gold in that I, I feel passion is our soul energy, the things that really light us up as, as soulful beings.

[00:20:22] And so when we activate that, it, it, we notice it. That's the activation of our spiritual energy. That to me is what that is.

[00:20:28] But I love what you said about the 'cause it's compounding. Those small micro changes that we can make now

[00:20:35] do compound and, and you nailed it. What ends up happening is we start to shift our feeling state, our emotional state, recognizing that, oh wait, this is possible. And I don't think people realize that you can start with the end in mind.

[00:20:49] Like I, you will have an idea of what that may be. You gave an example just now, but it, it's not this. doesn't have to be. You're going to figure out what it is and how you get [00:21:00] there.

[00:21:00] Aleana Kali: Yes, absolutely.

[00:21:01] Brandon Ward: that with the end state that I would like and, and you just, you know, let's say it's a retreat center you mentioned, right?

[00:21:08] Or a life that's driven around freedom or family, whatever it may be. You could be miles away from that today. It doesn't matter. The importance is you, you see that vision of where you want to go and you just take a 1% belief that it's possible and you start something small. If it's, even if it's a two minute journaling practice that says,

[00:21:30] I can do this, this is what I want every morning.

[00:21:34] You will find over time as you do that, that those compounds will start to gain. Ideas will start to come into your mind

[00:21:41] at, you'll start to recognize, wait a second, I'm actually undermining my progress the way I'm doing things right now

[00:21:48] based on where I want to go. Because if we don't have that true north, We're aimlessly wandering.

[00:21:55] And

[00:21:55] I think your story, what you described earlier, Eliana, about [00:22:00] what drove you to where you are today, is something so many of us feel, especially when we're young. It is just a lack of direction. We're just

[00:22:07] drifting. And truthfully, in my life, there's nothing more painstaking and miserable than just being adrift at the sea of life with no vision, no direction.

[00:22:19] 'cause you're now just being pushed around all that's a terrifying and horrible place. I mean, honestly, it's pretty terrible .

[00:22:24] But,

[00:22:25] Aleana Kali: absolutely is.

[00:22:26] Yeah.

[00:22:26] Brandon Ward: that it, to your point and what you were saying, it starts with understanding first where you are. And I love the idea, and I, I've used this exercise a lot. If there was no money, if money wasn't an object, if you could start with a clean slate, just like what you're doing with your clients.

[00:22:41] What would you do? Forget the practicality of it, the logic, your education,

[00:22:46] your career. Throw all that crap out. Like you said, throw that, get, get out of the box. Like that's the box. We're ignoring the box right now. So 'cause in there will be that true north, it may take a little time to clarify what it is, [00:23:00] but in there is that true north?

[00:23:02] And there, I, I can promise our listeners out there, there is no greater path to live than that of one that is pursuing our true north. Even if

[00:23:13] Aleana Kali: Oh my goodness. Yes.

[00:23:15] Brandon Ward: path.

[00:23:15] Aleana Kali: I love that you said that. That's exactly it. It's like it's a project of a lifetime.

[00:23:22] Our true north is not the job that we do. It's, it's your whole life and the message that you came here to deliver through your life. Um, one thing about passion is that it's actually the clue to that, to North Star. It's both the North Star. The purpose in and of itself is to live in that state of bliss, and it also guides you towards it. So I'll give you an example. I had this intuitive, I don't know, intuitive maybe is a little bit of a fancy word. It just came to me at some point in 2014, January, 2014. For out of nowhere I was like, I need to go to India. [00:24:00] No connection to India. No friends, no family, nothing, nothing whatsoever. So, you know, out of nowhere, and I was like, this is crazy. It makes no sense. But I did, I had this strong, like, I don't know. So I, I did it and that opened up the door to so many things and it turned into eight years of travel, which was supposed to be two months.

[00:24:22] It turned into eight years. And so many

[00:24:24] experiences that became part of the work that I'm doing at BZA Life today that I had no idea I needed to learn over there for the, because I had no idea about this work. But

[00:24:34] it's like, it sounds like life. It's not almost, I mean, it's my belief, but you can think of it as like breadcrumbs leading you of

[00:24:42] this is do this and go do this and go do this. And then at some point, whether it's pre-planned or your brain somehow configures it, it doesn't matter to me. I don't, I don't care about the, like, was it intentional or not? The point is, there's some magic that the, your mind is going to configure at some point where it's like, [00:25:00] aha, this is what I want to do.

[00:25:02] I wanna combine this, this, and this, and create this, this new beautiful thing. I love it because as creators, human beings, the beautiful thing is that we have this capacity to connect these dots, to create something that's unique. We can do that. And, um, the other benefit of following your passion or following thing, the, the, the things that make you feel alive, as I like to say, what you mentioned earlier, right?

[00:25:26] Like this emotion, this state of being is that it makes being here and now good, which is a prerequisite for getting what you want out of life. You have to make peace with where you are. You have to make it better. You have to make it. Okay. To be here forever. And once you accept here and now, then getting where you want to go is so much easier and it's much more likely because if you're, the only reason you wanna go there is because being here is very painful, and that's the only thing that you do.

[00:25:59] You [00:26:00] just, your whole life is about avoiding pain. You really aren't tapping into, into what you're needing to do. You're not tapping into it. Um, and I, I would like to add one more thing, but I don't wanna speak at you because I know I've been going like multiple, I took, I took like a couple of, uh, notes as you were, um, talking because this is, this is really gold.

[00:26:20] This is stuff that I believe if people can start moving in that direction of just making more choices day to day, to follow their bliss, to do things that bring them joy, to allow themselves really to be here and now and enjoy the day, it can open up. It can open up doors that are unimaginable. I didn't know this kind of life was possible for me. Um, and one last thing I'm gonna add before I close this, there's, there is a piece of content I put out a few weeks ago called the one 30 Method. As you were speaking about, you know how hard it is to like make a plan when you have no idea [00:27:00] how to approach something because it's so big, right? It's like I wanna build that retreat center like you talk, like you talked about, but I

[00:27:05] have no resources.

[00:27:06] Brandon Ward: of my twenties, by the way. Like

[00:27:08] everything was way too big to even fathom. But sorry,

[00:27:11] Aleana Kali: Me too. Me too. No, no, no. Like, that's a really good point because that, that is purely driven by that place of feeling like you're not good enough, right? Because I didn't feel good enough, so I always felt like I needed to achieve more. And no matter what I achieved, I was like, no, I need to 10 x this 100 x this. I need to have the biggest achievement in town. I can't, I can't accept being just mildly successful. I have to be massively successful, you know? But I have something called the one 30 method, and basically it's a process to break down those gigantic ideas, such as building a retreat center. How do you figure out with just 10 hours of work and just a hundred dollars testing the minimum viable version, if you will, of this dream in like tiny 10 hour projects, instead of building an entire [00:28:00] retreat center, here's how to approach it and keep testing for another 12 months. So between now and a year from now, you have some traction, even though you don't have money to create a retreat center. So it's not just for retreat centers, this is really for breaking down any, uh, unrealistic, if you will plan or something. How do you make that realistic and turn it into an actual plan that you can start working on today? So it's called the one 30 method. It's okay, I can share it after the,

[00:28:25] Brandon Ward: Yeah, I'll make sure to put it in the show notes if you created a video around it. 'cause I, that sounds like you explained the process in your video.

[00:28:31] Aleana Kali: I, yeah, yeah,

[00:28:32] Yeah. I explained the process in the video. That's why it's called one 30.

[00:28:35] I know it's a lot,

[00:28:36] you know, when you're going through it, it can be really overwhelming when you have no idea what you wanna do and

[00:28:42] somebody's like, figure out what you wanna do, create a plan, do this, do you know?

[00:28:47] Yeah.

[00:28:47] Brandon Ward: it well, and it can, to your point, I think it's, that's why self-compassion and being loving and accepting of who we are is so important. And also recognizing, like we said earlier, that the true north component is a lifelong pursuit. It's [00:29:00] not an end state that you're trying to drive at. It's a

[00:29:03] way of living. It's, it's a way of

[00:29:04] operating your life.

[00:29:06] Aleana Kali: Yes.

[00:29:07] Brandon Ward: to me, that and that, that's what changed. As I've gotten older, I stopped thinking about where I, 'cause I was looking at everything as I need to go there to be happy. I need to go

[00:29:17] there to be happy. I need to be there. Once I do this, then I can, once I blah, blah, blah.

[00:29:21] We

[00:29:21] all do that. We all do these. Once I do this, then I'll be this. Once I have that, then I'll have this

[00:29:27] Aleana Kali: Mm-hmm.

[00:29:28] Brandon Ward: it. It's a trap though. It's a trap because the only moment we ever have is now, and. But that doesn't mean we forgo the future. That doesn't mean we don't, because the, the, the believing that things are possible are crucial to that as well.

[00:29:41] But like, this doesn't happen overnight.

[00:29:44] And you mentioned too, something that I, I thought is important is there's a difference between misery, depression, sadness, isolation, separation in yourself, and discomfort and struggle while you're building something big. There's a huge difference. And I think [00:30:00] our culture can sometimes overvalue feeling good all the time, right?

[00:30:05] Like we talked about it, like kind of needing to feel good all the time, but recognizing that discomfort struggle, challenge when we're pursuing our true north is actually incredibly fulfilling. It's rewarding to say, wow, I started with nothing. I've been at this for three years and now look at what I've done.

[00:30:23] Like, was that easy? No, but oh my goodness. It's so rewarding and fulfilling. And as creators, you mentioned this too, The creative process to me that like, when we're putting these things out into the universe, that's how we co-create. We don't need to know how it will become. Our job is to state the vision that we res, that resonates in our souls, clarify what that is and, and honor that daily, right.

[00:30:49] Telling the universe,

[00:30:50] this is what we want, this is what we want, this is what we want. And magically, however it does shit just starts happening. Like, you can't even, it's [00:31:00] bizarre. When I first watched The Secret, I was like, oh, this is bss and I thought

[00:31:03] all you had to do is sit around and dream, which is also bss.

[00:31:06] You

[00:31:07] absolutely have to take action,

[00:31:08] but it, for me, it comes from that love within ourselves and just pursuing that creative process and, and leaning into discomfort.

[00:31:16] I, there's a difference. Right. Would you, would you agree with that Eliana?

[00:31:19] Aleana Kali: absolutely. 100%. So, there's so much I would love to, to, to say about this, but the first thing I wanna note to the point of secret, right?

[00:31:27] Uh, the secret, I don't, I honestly don't lean too much on beliefs as much as my own personal experience, and I invite anyone. Who, who's listening. If you hear something and you're like, okay, that sounds good, this sounds great.

[00:31:40] Just try it. Just try it in your own life. Test it and see if it works for you or not. Here's what I found works for me, being who I need to be while I'm doing the action. And I think this is the problem that people aren't getting, that I wasn't getting for the longest time. And that maybe in the teachings [00:32:00] of, um, you know, stuff like The Secret or whatever, they probably, I don't know if they missed it or, I think what makes the difference is that when you start to envision that you're already there, not only are you, um, more motivated because you're constantly reminded of the thing, which it's very easy to forget why we are waking up every morning creating content and doing things when we're not seeing immediate results.

[00:32:22] In the beginning, it's easy to forget why you're doing it, so you have to constantly remind yourself of the vision and being excited about the vision. But more than that, As you begin to see yourself as somebody who is living that life, you begin to behave as the person who has that end goal. And guess what? If you act like the person who has that goal every day, you're constantly doing the thing as if you are the person. Ultimately you're gonna become the person and you're gonna create the thing that the person is creating is, there's nothing magical about it. Even if we wanted to look at it as like a, even the most skeptical person can understand even the most [00:33:00] quote unquote unspiritual or un, not, not that there's such a thing, but somebody who just rejects all these kinds of notions and, and maybe is skeptical, which I totally understand because at some point I was very, very, very, very skeptical and very tired of these things that are being

[00:33:15] taught right about like spirituality or whatever.

[00:33:17] I was like, oh God, like I've heard so much BSS and I wanted to see like, show me what's real, what's true. Well, even if you're skeptical, you can, you can see how logically, how this would work. We are programming ourselves, like we think that we are stuck in one way or another, or that, um, we, I am just this way or not this way.

[00:33:40] I can do things. I, I suck at. Execution is something I hear a lot from people who are creative and visionaries. Like I'm the visionary type, but it's hard for me to do the work. It's hard for me to execute. That's not true. That's not true. And you can easily, uh, shift into not, you don't even have to like reprogram [00:34:00] yourself over months and years.

[00:34:00] You can easily become that person in the next minute. Just take the action, let go of who you think you are. Let go of how you think you should behave as an introverted person versus a, uh, an extroverted person as a procrastinator versus somebody who takes action. Let go of how you view yourself and just do the thing as though you are. That is the concept, I think the core of the teaching of something like the Secret, you know?

[00:34:25] Brandon Ward: Hmm.

[00:34:26] Aleana Kali: yeah. So.

[00:34:27] Brandon Ward: It's, and it's, it's interesting too, because we overthink those things, and really, in my mind, that's the resistance to the growth mindset. And it's still us judging ourselves. We're not embracing love within who we are. We're not

[00:34:40] accepting who we are. We're staring at a blank page and we're saying, oh, I can't do this.

[00:34:44] But really what we're saying is that I don't have the skills to do it. I don't have the creative power to do it.

[00:34:49] Like we hide behind this visionary concept of, I'm a visionary, I can't do it.

[00:34:54] Aleana Kali: Yeah.

[00:34:54] Brandon Ward: it's like, actually, this is my way of preventing myself from failing, quote

[00:34:59] unquote. [00:35:00] But the only failure in life is to not act and be as we are.

[00:35:04] And I

[00:35:05] love that.

[00:35:06] Aleana Kali: I

[00:35:07] Brandon Ward: Well, because we're, it's the, it's a, it's a trick. It's very counterintuitive to think that the way to do the things in life that you really truly desire is to be who you truly are.

[00:35:17] Like that's the trick. And because

[00:35:19] once you connect from

[00:35:21] within, you tap into that power within yourself.

[00:35:25] There's all this depth and treasure and richness that starts emanating out of you, that the universe starts pulling you forward

[00:35:32] to where you become this thing that you didn't even know you were.

[00:35:35] Aleana Kali: you were right.

[00:35:36] Isn't that interesting? That's

[00:35:38] just like

[00:35:38] Brandon Ward: if you're telling

[00:35:39] Aleana Kali: being revealed.

[00:35:40] Brandon Ward: Exactly, exactly. You're revealing. But that's the thing though, if you're telling yourself, though, I'm the visionary, I can't do this.

[00:35:47] I'm not a

[00:35:47] doer, I can't execute. That's, you're my buddy that, that's Andrew. He's a, a brilliant book, a prior episode guest with you. His whole thing is around your Stuckey story. That's your Stuckey [00:36:00] story telling

[00:36:00] you that you, like, you're not

[00:36:03] a doer.

[00:36:04] Aleana Kali: Yeah. Yeah.

[00:36:04] Brandon Ward: Eliana and I, and I say this with, with deep feeling, because I was once that person, I used to believe that I couldn't do things.

[00:36:14] I was all this until I. Really started embracing who I was. And I will say this, I'm, I'm, it's a bit of a pivot out, but quitting porn as a man, watching quit watching that I watched, I stopped four over four years ago. That completely changed my ability to focus and be productive as well. So my point is, we can tell ourselves these stories for very long times, but it's all about accepting, embracing who we are and we absolutely can create and do.

[00:36:42] It's just we're afraid we have this perfectionism and

[00:36:45] we're not allowing ourselves to get messy. Like bro just slinging the shit. Like you just gotta sling the shit.

[00:36:52] Aleana Kali: Yeah.

[00:36:52] Brandon Ward: is shit slinging

[00:36:54] so much.

[00:36:55] Aleana Kali: Yes. Absolutely. I love that. I love that. I love that. I love that.

[00:36:59] It's like [00:37:00] the hardest thing about creativity or the creative process is to sit with a discomfort of like, I have no idea what the fuck I'm creating and this, this makes no sense to me. I needed to, like, there's this, this, especially if your work is in the creative work, right?

[00:37:18] Like you're writing content, for example, you're creating content, you kind of, there's that pressure to ship, there's that pressure to create. But then the, on the other hand, there's this part of you that wants to express itself, and then there's the sitting with the thing to create something and realizing how unskilled we are in some ways.

[00:37:34] Like, oh fuck, I hate this. Or the resistance, or Didn't get enough sleep last night and might've eaten, or, you know, whatever. Something that I shouldn't have eaten late at night, and now my brain is really foggy and I, I just don't feel like it. And you just sit down and you do it and it sucks and nothing good comes out of it.

[00:37:51] And you're like, holy shit, I need to ship this by exit. So it's the hardest thing is just to sit with that resistance, to sit with that discomfort of not knowing what the hell we're creating, [00:38:00] of not liking it, and just keep chiseling and keep creating until something comes out of it. I believe that these things are pre-created and they're being revealed through us. So it's like, of content. The idea is alive. It wants to come to life, but you, you know, it's gonna come through your filter, through your words, through your voice, and you have to get out of the way to allow it to be said through you and not judge it. You'll, you'll know when it's coming from the heart versus when you're creating it for performance. You'll know that if you're creating it, because it's your joy to share that versus when you're creating it because you think that's what the audience is expecting of you. There's a huge difference in creating, and I'm not saying don't create for the audience. Like, when I create content, I literally think about actual people.

[00:38:45] I'm thinking about this person that I want to,

[00:38:48] I wanna support them, or, you know, I'm, I'm, I want it to, to be a gift. I want it to help somebody. I want it to, but it makes me happy. I, I enjoy it. I love it, but, and I know [00:39:00] it's gonna be useful to somebody else. That's the sweet spot, right?

[00:39:02] Brandon Ward: And it's aligned with who you are too. That's a

[00:39:04] Aleana Kali: So

[00:39:05] Brandon Ward: too.

[00:39:05] Aleana Kali: that's

[00:39:06] the thing.

[00:39:06] Align with who you are is like, it brings you joy, right?

[00:39:09] Like if, if I draw, if I feel that this is coming from the heart, this is my gift to this person. If I were talking to a friend and giving them sincere advice, this is what I would say to them. Agenda aside, I have no, you know, if I'm not trying, forget about the fact that they're a potential client or a client, or a customer. Forget about that. Forget about the fact that I'm a quote unquote content creator. I'm just sharing as a human being to another, as a person, to another. What would I say to this person who is in this position where I was, you know, before, and I understand their pain, I understand their needs, I want to help them.

[00:39:43] I want to support them. What would I say to them? And how can I do it in a way that's meaningful to me and joyful to me, and doesn't drain me either? 'cause I'm not gonna go and spend five hours on the phone with a random person who's not. Pay me. Let's be real. Like I have to protect my boundaries too.

[00:39:56] It's not about I'm giving and giving and giving and giving, but what [00:40:00] can you give joyfully without any expectations that you're giving from the heart? You're just giving something from the heart. When you create from that place, you are giving yourself life. You're giving your life more, meaning you're helping the other person. It's a win-win for everybody. And that is the essence of creation. It's creation in and of itself for the purpose of itself. Like it is because it is, it's not like I am creating this, but I'm hoping that it, this will get me this many people to click through.

[00:40:30] Hmm. And I'm calculating that there's this many people who are gonna buy, and I spent all this effort and energy and time creating it.

[00:40:37] And then when it doesn't perform as good as I thought it would, I resented, oh,

[00:40:41] fuck this niche. And I'm It's what marketers

[00:40:46] do. It's the truth. It's the truth. When you're creating

[00:40:50] Brandon Ward: seriously though that that is.

[00:40:52] Aleana Kali: you know

[00:40:53] Brandon Ward: You just wanna throw everything against a wall

[00:40:55] and just throw your arms up.

[00:40:58] But I think that's the, [00:41:00] that's the trap of expectations too. You know, my, my, my wife's had a blog that she's been building now, like for 18 months,

[00:41:07] and

[00:41:07] Aleana Kali: Oh,

[00:41:08] Brandon Ward: it's,

[00:41:09] Aleana Kali: work.

[00:41:09] Brandon Ward: dude blogging is, I have so much respect for her.

[00:41:13] Oh, people, people think it's this easy thing, and which it will be eventually, eventually,

[00:41:19] you know, three to five years from now when it's generating the income she desires. But in the meantime, she's just eating shit. Just creating.

[00:41:26] But, but to your point, she enjoys the process. She's, she's deeping her love for the process.

[00:41:32] She's expanding her skillset. When, when she started, she had so little belief in herself, and now she's teaching me things about s e o and showing me stuff to do,

[00:41:42] and we're layering in content strategy for my blog based on

[00:41:45] what she's been doing.

[00:41:46] So, but like that's the thing though. As we all start in that place where I don't know what the hell I'm doing, I don't know what I need to do.

[00:41:55] I have no skills. That's a beautiful place to be in, man. Like

[00:41:59] everyone [00:42:00] started there.

[00:42:01] That beginner's mind is so powerful and, and I think if we don't embrace that, that stops us from creating because again, that criticism, that judgment comes in, that lack of self-love and acceptance, and you said it earlier too, is boundaries that comes from love and compassion.

[00:42:19] Like there is no, we are not endless cups. We all need to honor our sovereignty. And unless we do that, and that's why aligning our service with who we are matters because there's an infinite number of ways we can serve people.

[00:42:33] But does it align with who we are?

[00:42:36] Does it match who we are and the way we want to give?

[00:42:39] If those things aren't aligned, it's not authentic, genuine service. And that's where kind of hidden ties, the expectations, the disappointments, the resentment, all that stuff starts bleeding in.

[00:42:50] Aleana Kali: Yeah. It's just so beautiful that you talked about boundaries and the way that you explained it. Bless you. The way that you talked about boundaries is so [00:43:00] It's so important to figure out what is it that is a non-negotiable to you when you're creative person, because you'll know things you're willing to change for the market and what things you're not willing to change.

[00:43:18] Even if it makes no sense, it makes, it makes, it does. It's not good for your, for example, okay. For example, I love creating content. I love making videos. I love creating it. If nobody watched, I'd still make, if nobody booked a call, I'd still make, well, not if nobody watched, but I'd still probably talk about these things.

[00:43:41] Maybe I'll record them and keep them to myself, but I just, I just love creating, I love creating this stuff. When I started, I started with an intention. It was, I had, uh, an agenda, if you will, of like, I'm gonna create content because that's how I'm gonna get. People to come in. The reality is [00:44:00] that's, that's not even the easiest way to attract people, if you will.

[00:44:05] That's not the lowest effort. The business is not the lowest effort, but I love it so much I do it. I know there are easier ways for me to, if I only cared about attracting clients and I I, and that's the only reason I'm creating content. I know there are different ways that I can do this that are easier, but to me it's a non-negotiable to express myself in my content. It's a non-negotiable for me to create from the heart. It's a non-negotiable for me to enjoy it. So whatever I do, even if every expert says, you can't, shouldn't do it this way. It's stupid, it's silly. I would still do it my way because that's what I enjoy doing. On the other hand, there are things I don't care about and I'm willing to listen to the expert advice in those cases and, and do the things that I know are gonna get me results faster, easier with less resources, et cetera.

[00:44:55] Because I don't, it's not that I don't care about these things, it's just like they're not [00:45:00] non-negotiables for me. You know, it's not a non-negotiable for me, for example, to have, um, video thumbnails that are not perfect. Like, to me it's not, it's not a non-negotiable. Am I gonna spend my time, energy, resources, extra resources there?

[00:45:15] No, because it's not a non-negotiable. It's not, it's not a non-negotiable for me. So I will do that. Uh, it's a non-negotiable for me to work with people who are aligned. So it doesn't matter if the person coming to me has an amazing opportunity. Uh, you know, uh, like they have a need for a service that I can provide and they're willing to pay a lot of money for, but I don't feel aligned with that person.

[00:45:39] I'm not gonna do it. Period. We have to know ourselves. We have to know ourselves and not judge ourselves or other people. It doesn't mean that the other person is, is bad and I'm good, or my method is right. The other person's, the other marketer's method is wrong.

[00:45:53] You know, I don't, I don't judge that other people do things differently and they like to have these complicated, you know, marketing [00:46:00] processes and systems and, and building funnels and pushing people down the funnel and trying really hard and doing things like trip wiring, which to me, like just the word itself is,

[00:46:09] Brandon Ward: It's a war. That's a trip wire. That's what

[00:46:12] Aleana Kali: in marketing, it's, it's a thing to, to trip, to trip the customer, to, to get the, to get the purchase.

[00:46:19] But you like, just listen to the word like trip, why it sounds bad, it sounds

[00:46:24] weird.

[00:46:24] Brandon Ward: Used in war. It's a warfare

[00:46:26] Aleana Kali: Exactly,

[00:46:27] yes, it's a war slash, you know, predatory term.

[00:46:30] But does it mean that this person is a bad person's doing it? No. The pro, it's just a different way of seeing life and a different level of consciousness, a different, different perspective, and let's be real, maybe different survival stages for, and I

[00:46:42] was at a stage in my life where I had no idea about the concepts that I'm talking about. And I'm like, it's not wrong. All everybody is doing it. Yeah. That's just how marketing works. That's just how business works. How else are we gonna do it? You know? So I'm like, well, there's nothing wrong [00:47:00] with it. I'm not stealing, I'm not, you know, but in the back

[00:47:03] of my mind, I'm doing all these things nowadays, it's a non-negotiable for me that I don't treat the other person as a lead or treat them as a, like a, you know, uh, like I don't have

[00:47:15] a transaction.

[00:47:16] Brandon Ward: Yeah.

[00:47:16] Aleana Kali: Yeah. They're still a, a quote

[00:47:18] unquote prospect. They're still a quote unquote lead. I just don't see, that's just not seeing them and treating them that way is, is important to me in my business. but we, we shouldn't be judging somebody who's doing it differently. That's their way, but my way, my non-negotiables.

[00:47:31] So it's important for everyone, no matter what work you're doing to know what are the most important things to you that you're not willing to compromise on. And then everything else you can just play around. But like, I always like to say, no, the rules before you break the rules of the game. Like learn

[00:47:44] how to learn what works and what gets you the results.

[00:47:48] When you hear an expert give you advice, if it's not against your values, it's not against, you know against you, but you're not sure, try it. But if you find that it's, it doesn't work for you for whatever reason, you don't have to [00:48:00] justify yourself, just it doesn't work for you, period. It's not for you. It's not for me to slide into people's dms. I know that's an easy way to go to a stranger and be like, oh, you have this pain point. Here's why I should help you. And some of them are gonna reject me and some of them are not. But it doesn't work for me, so I don't do it. Does that make sense?

[00:48:17] Brandon Ward: It totally. Again, it, it's all like the, the, the overarching theme of our conversation is really about anchoring into who you are

[00:48:24] authentically and, and just because someone operates differently, that's more authentic to them, or maybe it's not authentic to them, it doesn't make, it doesn't mean we need to judge them or criticize them or, or be harsh towards them.

[00:48:37] It's ultimately about understanding who we are, what matters to us, what we value, what we don't value, what we're willing to sacrifice on. Like when you were sharing my thought that kept like, don't do things despite yourself.

[00:48:51] Aleana Kali: Yes.

[00:48:51] That's such a good way

[00:48:53] to put,

[00:48:53] Brandon Ward: the time, like we do it all the time.

[00:48:56] So just, that's why honoring who we are, being authentic [00:49:00] to who we are is crucial and defining the standards of success by who we are from within.

[00:49:06] Because society has a certain set of standards for success, which is

[00:49:10] personally, I find to be extremely annoying. Like the putting money above all. Like that's one of the things that it's, it's like you, people won't even listen to you unless you make a certain amount of money or have a certain level of success, even though what you're saying perhaps you've been saying for 20 years.

[00:49:27] And it's brilliant still whether you have success or not.

[00:49:30] It's just, I, I'm hoping that over time, And I see this changing. The market is tired of the fakeness, all the social media tools,

[00:49:39] all the filters, all the nonsense, but none of it's real. One of my friends sent me a video of a, a girl on TikTok, and she was showing the layers of filters that you can put on to videos, and the very last one was her outside in the sun, and she had, she was go, she had some sort of allergic [00:50:00] reaction that she was going through, but the first video, it was like the, the, the filters, the makeup, all this stuff.

[00:50:07] And then at the very end she's showing her authentic. Still a very beautiful woman. Like that's what's crazy to me though, is that we have these, we're starting to see that the world isn't real

[00:50:17] Aleana Kali: Mm-hmm.

[00:50:18] Brandon Ward: so many ways,

[00:50:19] but that authenticity and genuinely loving who we are and embracing who we are and not putting up these kind of presentations,

[00:50:26] I think is a way to find more peace and happiness within and, and now, Ana, I'm not a female.

[00:50:31] Right. I don't have the, I, I'm not gonna be a hypocrite, or in the sense that I don't feel like beauty standards are applied the same way as they are to women and men. They're not. I, I just,

[00:50:43] but I, what I'm getting at is being authentic to who we are, being more honest and in general as a society, and realizing that none of us have all the answers.

[00:50:51] All of us have goofy stuff on our face. We have breakouts, we have stuff on our team, like, we all poop.

[00:50:57] Everyone poops. Like, it's like, yeah, [00:51:00] right? Just, it just floats out like roses and flowers.

[00:51:02] Aleana Kali: I have a book. I have a book that's it's unicorn and cupcakes. I have

[00:51:06] a, a book in the bathroom that says, um, it's called The Woo of Poo by Susie Tiz. And I love it.

[00:51:12] Uh, Susie Tiz is the founder of, uh, of, uh, Poopourri and Supernatural.

[00:51:17] Brandon Ward: Ooh.

[00:51:17] Aleana Kali: And she is, she was, uh, my gateway to some of the business spirituality stuff, right? I, uh, you know, I, I aligned with her because my, I, I, I realized, you know, I was, I had the domain name brands are alive.com for a while before I actually started doing something with it for years. Uh, and I just got it. I was like, I know I need to do something with this. I don't know what to do with it.

[00:51:42] Brandon Ward: There you go. Prime example of what we talked about earlier, by the way,

[00:51:45] Aleana Kali: Following.

[00:51:46] Brandon Ward: I.

[00:51:47] Aleana Kali: And guess what? One day I'm just, I'm talking about her to one of my clients. I'm talking about, I'm more, I'm talking about her business to one of my clients. There's a use case. I'm like, here's a use case of this business is doing blah, blah. And then I was like, let me dig into this founder story.

[00:51:59] It's actually quite [00:52:00] impressive. Um, signed up to her newsletter. Two days later, literally two days later, she rolled out a, um, uh, a program called Alive oss. And I was like, alive? Mm, okay, I'm interested. Yeah. I'm like, whatever. Let's just, let's roll with this. Let's see where this goes. Uh, and what was amazing to me is that a lot of the ideas that I was secretly writing for years I was writing and I thought I was crazy. Mad woman. I'm just like writing about marketing and like connection between branding and spirit and blah, blah, blah. And then what was, uh, reassuring to me about this whole thing is I meet this woman who is, has, um, two, nine figure businesses that she built from scratch. So clearly she is, uh, she knows what she's doing, but she was on the scale of, uh,

[00:52:45] Brandon Ward: That's a hundred million y'all. Nine figures is a

[00:52:47] Aleana Kali: Oh yeah, it's actually, yeah. Yeah. She has multiple nine figure business, nine figure businesses like, or two businesses, uh, generating multiple nine figures. So yeah, like numbers that I can't wrap my head

[00:52:59] around. [00:53:00] And yet she shared some of these same ideas and she had this thing called the live us, and she's talking about following these, these, um, intuitions and how, you know, these breadcrumbs of desire are the key to your purpose and that sort of thing.

[00:53:13] So I'm like, okay, this means I am clearly, yeah. I don't know what happened there. It's just like blurred for a second. I was like, okay, clearly I, I am, might be onto something here, so maybe I should prob, you know, so it was very encouraging to, to find somebody that I, I looked up to her and I, I thought, okay, I thought I wasn't good enough.

[00:53:33] My business was not making anywhere near that kind of money, but she is. So, you know, I used to be like everybody else impressed by these things and be like, Oh, this person must know what they're talking about because they have the results that I can only dream of. So it, it actually turned out to be a good thing because it was like, oh, look at that. Um, I, I, she know, I know, I know that this person knows what she's talking about as far as business at least, and [00:54:00] yet she has some of the same beliefs. And of course, doing the inner work after that for years made me realize. Actually, nobody has all the answers. I don't. She doesn't. Nobody does. I still love her.

[00:54:11] She's, she knows a lot of answers, but I'm just saying in general, right? In general, nobody knows what the heck is going on. And even, even if you know how to do something, like you were talking earlier, you said, when we're starting out, we're figuring things out and we have no idea. What I realized actually is even if you know what you're doing, you're still gonna struggle sometimes.

[00:54:31] Like I know all that I know about. I was a marketing consultant for almost a decade before I started Brands life. I was a marketer. Since 2008, I had multiple businesses, and yet I'm building a brand for myself. I still struggled a lot. There's a lot I didn't know about this type of business, this type of business model. This, uh, sharing my message, building a brand and a business, uh, um, I'm sorry. A brand and marketing yourself is different from branding and marketing a product that

[00:54:59] you're selling. When [00:55:00] you're behind the scenes, you have to show yourself, there's a lot of inner work that needs to be done. There's a lot of fear to be worked through, so you're, you're, you're, you know, unless you're doing literally the same thing over and over and over, you're waking up every morning and you're eating like the same breakfast, lunch, dinner, and you're doing the same exact type of work and you're hanging out with the same type of people, you're probably going to be very uncomfortable.

[00:55:20] So

[00:55:20] better make friends with it. But yeah,

[00:55:23] do follow your, follow your desires. Follow your desires.

[00:55:26] Brandon Ward: Well, and it's such, that's such a great story too, Eliana, because ultimately you, you had this person who was the seed for you to pursue this path in a lot

[00:55:35] of ways. Like a, a seed of validation. And

[00:55:37] I think there

[00:55:39] are, I can, there are people that I can look back in my journey of, of, I, I think just more than anything, just connecting with who I truly am who have been validation for points of us.

[00:55:49] Like, wow, look at this person. Look at the things that they've shared, look at what they've done,

[00:55:53] and then the message that they're carrying with them. And you're, it's, it's hope that you don't have to be a robot or you don't have to be an [00:56:00] automaton, or you don't have to be a replica to create success because.

[00:56:05] The world that we're moving into, the time and space that we're moving into will be the key differentiator because with all these automations, AI technology, everything's gonna become very cookie cutter box.

[00:56:19] Aleana Kali: Yes.

[00:56:20] Brandon Ward: everything's getting so safe. Safe words, safe spaces. Don't say this, everybody's offended.

[00:56:25] Like,

[00:56:26] oh my God. Eventually people are gonna get to a point, where're like, dude, I just want somebody who's real.

[00:56:33] I don't need the most expert. Whatever. We didn't even get into that, by the way. And we're running up

[00:56:38] Aleana Kali: Yes. I know. That's

[00:56:39] crazy. It went by so fast.

[00:56:41] Brandon Ward: I know, um, we're definitely gonna have to do a follow on episode at some point, but let, if we can, Leona, I think that would be a nice spot to maybe wrap is talk briefly, kind of, because when we first spoke initially offline, um, I called you a branding expert and you pushed back on that.

[00:56:55] So I let, let's dig into that a little bit

[00:56:57] Aleana Kali: I did

[00:56:57] Brandon Ward: can wrap.

[00:56:58] Aleana Kali: I pushed back on most, on all, [00:57:00] probably all labels. It's just,

[00:57:01] it's nothing against,

[00:57:02] Yeah.

[00:57:02] It's ,but it's true. That's what I, that's kind of what I do. Yeah. Not what I am, but what I do. Yeah. Branding, marketing, of course. Yeah. That's what I do.

[00:57:11] Brandon Ward: But the, the expert piece, right? And I think

[00:57:13] Aleana Kali: Oh yeah. The,

[00:57:14] Brandon Ward: the

[00:57:15] overvaluing of experts.

[00:57:17] Aleana Kali: Oh man,

[00:57:18] I could,

[00:57:18] Brandon Ward: our own integrity, our own

[00:57:20] vision, our own creativity.

[00:57:23] Now, that doesn't mean we don't look to experts. That doesn't mean we don't learn from people who are very specialized. I'm not saying ignore people who know things in a deep level.

[00:57:31] What I'm saying is, and I, and I'm curious what your take on this is because, Experts can help us, but ultimately it's still our responsibility. We make the the end call even going to the doctor, A doctor can give us their recommendations. We treat these recommendations like they're the gospel. They're not,

[00:57:47] we ought to know damn well better.

[00:57:49] What's happened the last few years too, by the way. There were a whole bunch of experts telling us

[00:57:53] all kinds of things that have actually turned out to be super wrong. Mm-hmm. . So it's dangerous in that sense, like we have [00:58:00] an over level of confidence in the expertise of others, but we undermine the value and power that we hold as individuals.

[00:58:06] And I think one of the key components of this, and I wanna pass it over to you, is discernment and trusting ourselves and discerning information. And if we feel hesitation with

[00:58:17] anything regardless of who it's coming from, we have to honor that. We have to allow that thing to bubble up and at least pursue it because it could be protecting us or taking us on a path that's more aligned with who we are from the center.

[00:58:32] Aleana Kali: That is so very beautifully said. Um, you basically just covered it, all of it really. That was, that was, no, I, I love it. I love it. Thank you so much for, for like, it's such a beautifully put way of saying, Hey listen, you should listen to experts. But listen doesn't mean act upon what the recommendations are.

[00:58:57] Just listen to what they're saying. Consider it. And the word [00:59:00] that you said that, that you know was a light bulb moment from you is discernment. That is it. Cultivate the ability to discern, discern and trust that you know more than you think you do. If you're talking to somebody, an expert, a self-proclaimed expert, and they may be an expert and they may actually give you real good advice, but you have to learn to not only discern, but also listen to the signals that you're getting, and you're gonna get signals in your body. You're gonna get signals in your emotions. You're gonna get signals in your mind, as in as thoughts. You're gonna get signals as an intuitive hit. You're gonna get signals as, um, doubt, fears. Consider everything that comes up. Do not do an override. I think

[00:59:48] we, everybody has that intuitive capacity within them to know if something is not right, something is telling you, Hey, hold on.

[00:59:58] I know you're excited about listening to [01:00:00] this expert and paying them this amount of money to get started on the program that's finally going to change your life, but, Maybe there isn't just one thing that's gonna change your life. Maybe the answer isn't supposed to be in just one place. Maybe there's no savior coming.

[01:00:15] Maybe

[01:00:15] you don't need to be saved.

[01:00:17] Maybe you don't need to be saved from anything. Maybe you're fine. Maybe just maybe this expert is telling you the truth and they know what they're talking about, but this is not the answer, the thing that you need right now. Maybe there's work for you to do internally. Ultimately, the quote unquote experts is someone who knows more than you do, who has more experience than you do. So it's completely relative. Um, I made a video a long time ago called, can you be seen as an expert if you're open about where you are in your journey? Because this creates this pressure of pretending to be much further than we really are in our knowledge and our skill and that sort of thing.

[01:00:53] 'cause we wanna be perceived as experts. So we fear that we're not experts enough. Um, the reality is [01:01:00] it's, it's completely subjective. You want something, you find somebody who has done the thing, who knows how to do it, and their way works with you. It's in an alignment with who you are. This is why it's always so important to know who you are, to be in alignment with your authentic self. And then it's a matter of choosing, does this work for me? What exactly are they promising me? Is it a cat in a bag or are they telling me exactly what am I gonna get if I pay them? Sometimes it's hard to get promises. Like I will never promise someone that if you work with me within three months, you're gonna be making six figure, seven figure.

[01:01:30] Like, I can't make that kind of promise.

[01:01:32] I can never, there are so many variables, but I can promise that I'm gonna give you this many sessions and I'm gonna, you're gonna get, uh, like a, let's say a three month strategy, and I'm gonna break it down. I, I, I get very specific about what exactly I am selling you.

[01:01:45] The deliverables. I get very, very specific and I tell you at your stage, this is where I think you might end up in a few months. This is where I think you will end up doing this. But I don't make that promise of like, these are the results that you're gonna get. [01:02:00] Even though I am, quote unquote an expert,

[01:02:02] and I don't lean too much on that because even though I believe that's, that's very possible, there are too many variables.

[01:02:08] And it's not that people did the work or you didn't know you showed up or you didn't show up. You know, like the whole language of blaming the client or customer for not getting the result when the programs don't work and being like, well, it's because you didn't do the work. My program is perfect. I'm the expert, but it's all on you. You were not showing up. You were, you didn't want it badly enough, you know?

[01:02:27] Brandon Ward: I've got that before, I've,

[01:02:28] I've definitely been shamed into paying thousands of dollars and you're the problem.

[01:02:33] Aleana Kali: I paid a coach 20 K at some point for few hours. And, and she was, and at some point she's like, are you gonna do it or are you gonna keep bitching and m moaning about

[01:02:45] Brandon Ward: And

[01:02:45] Aleana Kali: literal, actual, this actually happened. And I was like, excuse me. Uh,

[01:02:49] anyway, so.

[01:02:50] Brandon Ward: talk to me like that. First and foremost, I any, yes, I holy rabbit hole, isn't it?

[01:02:55] Aleana Kali: It's fine. Yeah. A whole nother rabbit hole. No, like no hard feelings. Honestly, I [01:03:00] laugh at it because it's really funny. But, you know, she, she, whatever. Uh, the point is even people like insane amounts of money for a specific result. And then, and, and I had many of these like wasted things in my life in the past where I would spend absurd amounts for nothing and always thinking that the next thing with this next expert is going to unlock some magical key that is suddenly going to make me achieve all of my, it doesn't work that way, dude.

[01:03:27] It's like a whole practice. And you hire experts to teach you skills. I'm big on teaching skills, so when you work with me, like if somebody were to work or work with me, I would never be like, you know, we're just gonna show up and wing it. Like I will teach them skills to market themselves, to promote themselves, to build the brand for themselves so they have that for the rest of their life.

[01:03:46] So hire an expert to either do the work for you or to teach you the skill or to walk with you to do it. But don't expect that they're going to, um, somehow magically fix all of [01:04:00] your problems just because they are, quote unquote experts. And I love, what I love most about what I, what you said is always bringing it back to leaning on, trusting ourselves, our inner guidance, and knowing that we ultimately always have the answer. We can figure out the answer. There's not one expert that you, you're gonna die if you don't work with this one person, or if you don't take this one program, there are infinite ways to achieve the same results. So yeah, there's a lot to be said there. So, so I'll just,

[01:04:29] Brandon Ward: Oh my goodness, I love it. No, that's, well, it's become very clear to me that we're definitely gonna have to have a follow on session at

[01:04:35] Aleana Kali: we

[01:04:35] need, we need another one.

[01:04:37] Brandon Ward: this was great. so Eliana, for the listeners out there, where can they find you? What are you up to? If they're interested in what you're doing?

[01:04:46] I'll have obviously a lot of the, the stuff in the show notes here for you, but, you know, before we part ways, what would you like to share with the audience?

[01:04:53] Aleana Kali: Sure. Um, go to brands are live.com/mojo, m oj o. You'll find it in the menu. [01:05:00] Brands are live.com. This is my, uh, weekly newsletter. I send a video almost every week. Uh, right now I have something called the Starter Kit. Uh, when you sign up, it'll give you, uh, like it'll take you to a page with four videos and three articles. If you're completely, like, I have no idea where to start with all of your content, where do I go to start building my brand of full self-expression? I have four videos and three articles that you get in a starter kit if you sign up. And after that, I send about a video a week or an email a week with, um, things that I am, you know, sharing along the way about building a brand of full self-expression. Also on LinkedIn is a good place to connect with me. Yeah.

[01:05:38] Brandon Ward: Very cool. Well, I'm gonna sign up. I didn't even know that you had Mojo. I know. I know you have Mojo. I didn't know you had a product called Mojo that you

[01:05:46] Aleana Kali: Oh, it's not.

[01:05:47] No, no, it's not. It's a newsletter. It is a newsletter, but, but they do get a free starter kit that's like, um, four videos with the three articles, um,

[01:05:57] with like exercises that help them do things [01:06:00] like clarifying what is your brand's essence or the emotion of your brand. Uh, the 80 20 of branding.

[01:06:06] How do you explain to people what is it that you do when you have no idea what your niche is? Um, the one 30 method that I talked about, which helps you turn your dreams into a reality with a step-by-step process in, in,

[01:06:17] 10 to 12 months. Um, I have these three articles that are for clarity about your marketing messaging.

[01:06:23] Uh, one is for how do you tell the story of your brand and your values? And then the other one, if I remember correctly, is, uh, what was the other one? Oh, yeah. Brand positioning. Right. So I like, I like to give them exercises, templates, and things that they can, they can follow if they're just gonna, you know, do it themselves.

[01:06:42] Um, and

[01:06:42] hopefully, you know, hopefully it helps somebody out. Yeah.

[01:06:45] Brandon Ward: Sounds like it definitely will. I mean, honestly, that's the whole point for me with order within is if we can just provide a little bit of these breadcrumbs, a little bit of seeds along the way that can 'cause the reality is you gotta take what works for you, throw away the stuff that doesn't.

[01:06:58] I'm definitely gonna sign up for your [01:07:00] newsletter. That's great. I think people who are looking for this type of directional, like the inner authentic direction of the branding, this could benefit greatly. So

[01:07:08] Aleana Kali: Absolutely. And, and this is, this is just the newsletter, but if they want like one-on-one help, I do have, um, some offers on the site. I actually have tried my best to also provide all the details and the pricing in there, so I don't do the thing

[01:07:22] where we jump on a call for an hour and I try to dig your panes

[01:07:26] and figure out how to spell

[01:07:27] your, I'll just give you everything there and then if you want to discuss further, they can book a 15 minute with me and then we can chat some more.

[01:07:34] But

[01:07:34] I have, I try to give services. Yeah, I, I try to give services in different ranges. I am working on a product behind the scenes, but that's not released yet. So

[01:07:43] excited about that.

[01:07:44] Yeah.

[01:07:44] Brandon Ward: that's great.

[01:07:45] Well, Eliana, I really appreciate you coming onto to the show. This was a

[01:07:49] fantastic conversation. I'm certain that the audience has got a lot of great value here, so, uh, we'll, we'll do a follow-up episode at some point in the future here. I really appreciate you coming on, so everybody out there [01:08:00] listening, I appreciate your eyes, your ears.

[01:08:02] We're adding a video element to this. The conversations are great. Eliana is a fantastic guest, so I really do appreciate you coming on, and with that being said, y'all, until next time.

[01:08:12] Thank you for listening to Order Within. If you found the episode helpful, please consider sharing, rating, and subscribing. New episodes will be released every Thursday at 11am Eastern Standard Time. Until next time, y'all.

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